Episode 186 Transcript

SUMMARY:

  • The misleading term "O word epidemic" in relation to fatness. 0:00

  • Obesity trends and life expectancy. 5:24

  • Flawed assumptions about obesity and health. 8:51

  • Weight stigma and its impact on society. 16:04

  • Fatness-related health costs and bias. 21:53

  • Fatness and its perceived societal burden. 27:38

  • Fatness, cost to society, and ethics. 34:56

  • Healthcare, stigmatization, and community support. 39:29

Read the transcript alongside the audio.

You're listening to the Fierce Fatty Podcast episode 186, But aren't we in an O word epidemic? Oh, let's do it.

Hello, welcome to this episode of the face value podcast. I'm your host, Vinny Welsby. My pronouns are they them, I'm so excited to talk to you today to be with you today to be in your ear today. Thanks for choosing the first high podcast to listen to your request, hey, if you want some training at your company, if you have a company and you have to EI, EI, person or dei group or an employee resource group or a dei committee, or maybe you have none of those things, you're like, wow, I wish I did my my company. But hey, I don't know if you know this, but I do corporate training. So yeah, and my so I don't scare people off. My corporate training isn't under the first fatty brand, because I feel like people are scared. Not everyone, obviously you like it. But the corporate side of my business is called weight inclusive consulting. And, yeah, if you ever want to know more about that, you can go to weight bias training.com I have a couple of resources. If you go there, weight bias training.com, I have a free this is a fat positive space poster. So you can print that off and put that your desk in your office home, wherever. And also a guide How to Create a size inclusive workplace. Both of those are free guides for you on not both of them are free guides. That's one free guide and one free poster. So just go to weight bias training.com. And there you go, little present for you. Today we're talking about the O word epidemic. And in case you get triggered or get activated when you see these headlines about the cost of fatness and society and what a terrible burden that people are. And you feel kind of lost because you think well, aren't there more fat people around? Aren't fat people are fat people are burden. They're saying that fat people cost $17 trillion a second, is that true? We're gonna be talking about that today so that you can feel a little bit more confident about how these figures are constructed, what they miss out what they include, which they shouldn't include, then just a little bit of history about this this stuff. So first off, I want to tell you what epidemic means. So, from the dictionary epidemic, affecting or tending to affect a disproportionately large number of individuals within a population, community or region at the same time. Excessively prevalent, contagious, characterized by a very widespread growth or extent of relating to constant constituting an epidemic. Okay, so affecting a large disproportionately large number of individuals. Okay, so let's let's say that most people live in bigger bodies. And with the the way that they're saying it here affect the way you view fat bodies like our fat bodies, something bad and negative and shouldn't be around. Then you would say, Well, I am not affected with fatness, I just am fat, whereas people who think that fatness is bad would say yes, we are affected by a disproportionately large number of individuals within a population. And then the next point here excessively prevalent, Are Fat People excessively prevalent and be contagious to you, but I have never actually infected anyone with my fat. Have you? Have you worked out how we can do that? So we can affect all of the things with our fatness. When that'd be amazing. Just go around and just, you know, rub up against a fat thin person or whatever, you know, two days later, they have a cough. And then you know, all of a sudden they they put on hundreds of pounds. Have you seen that happen? I don't know. I haven't seen it yet. But you know, you know, you never know. And part three of that of that definition is characterized by a very widespread growth or extent off. So are people fatter? People have gotten a little fatter since the 1970s. But straight science people aren't getting fatter. And weight has been relatively stable in population populations for decades. Also, as we are humans are learning to fight diseases and live longer. When we're just getting bigger as humans we're getting taller. Right. And to a little extent, although not really in the 70s since the 70s, but not more recently, our bodies have got a little bit bigger, is it an excessive, prevalent contagious levels? Know, it's simply not? It's just not true that every single year people are just getting bigger and bigger and bigger and it's out of control. And it's just not accurate as to what is happening happening with population levels. And even if it was, even if people were getting bigger, is not making us unwell at a population level level, because we're living the longest in human history. You might be saying, well, hang on, Vinnie. I've heard that quote. The quote is, this generations of generation of kids will outlive will not outlive their parents due to fatness. Remember, there was like a quote, kids are gonna die before they were before their parents. Well, that's, you know, that quote is definitely definitely backed by science. It's definitely not just one dude saying that was his prediction and opinion based on no science at all. Oh, wait, it is a pediatric pediatric gastroenterologist. He was on that. Remember that show? Not sure. It was a movie Supersize Me with Morgan Spurlock. He was on that. And he just thought it he just thought, I think that I think that fat kids and kids are going to die before their parents because they're so fat and disgusting. Has it happened? No. Did he have loads of data and science and evidence and etc. To back up this statement? No, he just picked it out of his ass. So this is the guy that said this is a symbol called William clish. And this is a quote from the O word crisis is a myth by Harriet Brown. And Harriet writes in 2002 William clish, a pediatric gastroenterologist featured on the movie Supersize Me told a reporter from the Houston Chronicle. If we don't get this O word epidemic in check. For the first time in this century, children will be looking forward to a shorter life expectancy than their parents. As caliche later admitted, he had absolutely no evidence for this frightening scenario. It was based on his, quote, intuition, which didn't stop it from being replayed in the media and cited by researchers. So cliche as doomsday scenario lives on in part because it's frightening. Yeah. And it makes a good headline doesn't it does not, doesn't it? Right. And those types of stories sell. People are interested in learning about how fatness or you know, fat people are walking around in, you know, containing the world with their fatness and how other people are awful, right? That sells sells newspapers. It's quite interesting, although, it is not true. What this guy said, but that that sticks that's probably stuck in your noggin. If you've been if you've been exposed to that that's probably stuck in your noggin about how awful fatness is and how this generation who knows what generation is talking about the generation from 2002 is going to have a shorter life expectancy than their parents because of fatness. Yeah, not so great. Also, the categories of what is considered, quote, normal weight, or overweight have changed because of the influence and lobbying of diet companies. They're also arbitrary numbers So, you think the BMI, obviously, we know if you listen to this podcast, the BMI is bullshit. But you think they'd be in my Well, they've calculated something. They've calculated something. No, the categories are 25, to 3035, to 3030, to 3535, to 40, etc. Because rounding to five sounded good.

It just sounded like it was easy to remember. So no actual scientific reason. And the most recent change in 1998 from the National Institutes, which Institute of Health sparked the rhetoric around the quote epidemic, which came from an overnight change in numbers on a chart within a day, millions of people were classes to fat when their bodies had not changed at all. So lobbying from diet pharmaceutical company saying, let's tell everyone they're too fat. And then overnight, someone you know, piece of paper. Yeah, these people are too fat now. Oh my god, we got so many fat people. What the heck? Did anyone actually get fatter? No. On paper they are because we change the definitions and make it make sense. And obviously, the whole premise of Oh word is based on the BMI which is 200 years old and data collected from white sis European men never meant to be a measure of individuals or health. Oh, epidemic presumes that people who fall into higher weight categories are automatically unhealthy, and a burden on society due to increase creased fat tissue on their bodies. And there is no evidence to prove that actually having more adipose or fat tissue on your body leads to poor health outcomes. We just don't have that data. We don't have that information. But what we do know that can cause poor health outcomes is one weight cycling aka going on a diet to subpar or lack of access to health care, and three experiencing anti fatness. We also have great evidence to show that, oh, people have reduced mortality compared to normal weight people, which is called the O paradox. The paradox being hmm, we thought that people were dying all over the place, but they ain't. It's a paradox. We just can't explain it, then. You know, the word paradox means a seemingly absurd or self contradictory statement or proposition that when investigated or explained may prove to be well founded or true. So that's a huge study that came from the CDC. And Catherine Fleagle. We have I think we have a whole episode on it. We must have dedicated a whole episode to it. The Oh word paradox just Google the show emotion Misha de paradox. First party and you'll probably find an episode on it. Yes, so why these these speakers are trashes. So you'll see all these headlines. Just a few headlines from the UK which is just so fucking anti fat. Newspaper headlines, Britain's child Oh word disgrace. Next headline we must win. Oh word war for the sake of the NHS. Next one. Oh word Britain. Britain has just fat from The Guardian meant to be a little bit more intelligent. Oh word bigger cost for Britain than war and terror. Britain spending x billion a year dealing with dealing with the healthcare and social costs of an increasingly Oh population study finds study finds is what the study finds is dogshit. So these figures they're not accurate and they assume that weight equals health. So it's numbers are derived from fat people who have health conditions that are associated with fatness, but not known to be caused by fatness. So if a fat person has type two diabetes, then they have a according to this data, they have a condition condition that's caused by fatness. If a thin person has type two diabetes, they don't have a condition caused by fatness. They just have type two diabetes. So you wouldn't then say okay, what's the cost of fineness? Well, let's calculate all the thin people who have type two diabetes well EQ for. That's what the cost of fitness is and on PSAs on society, what they do that with fat people, so there's no way to predict how many people die from fatness in any accurate way. And the reason for this is that there are zero health conditions that have been shown to be caused. Well, there's a big word there caused by fatness and something only fat people get versus health conditions being correlated with fatness and something that people of all sizes get. So that's a that's a big thing there causation correlation. There's nothing that only fat people get that then people don't also get. It's presumed that the presence of a fat body in society means the presence of disease, it's assumed if we have fewer fat people, there'll be then we will be more healthy as a population. And this is this is straight up faulty logic as faulty logic. The next reason why these figures are trash it stigmatizes humans and supports health ism and ableism. So it states that human beings are a burden for a non modifiable identity factor, body size, you're a burden because of something that is non modifiable about you know, human beings a burden, even if they are unhealthy, even if they quote cause their lack of health. All people are worthy of healthcare and disabled people or those with chronic conditions should be seen, at minimum at minimum equally important parts of our society. Another thing is it doesn't consider the cost of anti fat bias. It's which is a huge her huge problem with this, these these figures. So Dr. Khan, Paul Singh, Al, and friends points out in i'll link Ireland to everything in is a more to the equation, weight bias and the costs of a word. So Dr. Singh says points out that most if not all, of the estimated costs of fatness can actually be attributed to anti fat bias. Dr. Angela Meadows demonstrates that anti fat bias has a powerful impact on the health of fat people. Quote, chronic or repeated stress over time can result in multi system biological dysregulation, a concept known as allostatic load which is linked with a wide range of disease conditions including cardiovascular disease, diabetes, hypertension, and cancer. So calculating the cost of fatness without even considering anti fat bias is deeply problematic. And the whole even calculating the cost of fatness and being like oh my god, we're so fat lalala contributions to anti fat bias. So even this whole you know, all of those those really awful headlines existing increases the quote, costs of and of fatness on society, because people are experiencing more anti fat bias. Next, why these figures are dogshit they are used to advocate for the erasure of fat people. In Canada's most recent report on the quote, cost of fatness they point out that they don't really know why people are fat. They don't know how to make people smaller. And also that fat people have reduced mortality compared to quote normal weight people. Okay, let me just reiterate that. We don't know why people are fat. We don't know how to make people small and fat people have reduced more Tality compared to quote normal white people. But they still advocate for more policy and research to erase fat people from society this is a huge list this this this I did a whole episode on this report from Canada about the cost of the cost of Oh word. Oh, my lordy. And I was just reading it being like what the fuck? Hang on, white. You they had all these things? Hey, we don't know why people are fat. Hey, we don't know how to make people thin. Hey, fat people live longer. Oh, but still we need to make fat people disappear. Oh, it was low. Why it's me. Did you read what you just wrote? I just I don't understand I don't understand. Oh.

So all of this fuels fat hate. In a press release in 2022, the UK Government said, oh word costs the NHS a massive 6 billion annually. And this is set to rise over 9.7 billion each year by 2050. The new investment, what investment is it? An investment in weight loss, quote treatments, announced today is expected to save the NHS billions over time and ensure that vital funds are spent on key frontline services. So rhetoric like this, which positions fat people are stealing vital funds from quote, key frontline services deeply contributes to people's perceptions, that fat people are lazy, unintelligent, unhealthy, greedy, generally unwanted and undesirable. And we don't need government sponsored bigotry, although the UK is very good at it. And all this to say there's no reliable way to make fat people into thin people. So let's pretend let's say, you know, fat people are costing the world allegedly billions of dollars every single moment. And fat people are horrible and greedy, and we all will want to be a burden on society and enjoy it and, and all of that. Let's just say that's all true, it still wouldn't matter because we don't have any reliable way to make people smaller. Fat people exist, we always have, we always will. And instead of calculating the burden of fat people being alive, a better use of funds could be to continue to do some research on how to reduce anti fat bias and how to provide all people with equitable evidence based care. Where'd I know weird word. Also, the data in here is if a fat person has anything that's associated with fatness, high blood pressure, type two diabetes, hypertension, whatever it is, that person would then be calculated in the cost of fatness, right? Not only that, these figures also look at things like how many days off? Did a fat person take? Well, if a fat person takes a day off, the reason why they take a day off is because wonder wonder why I wonder why? Because they're fat. Therefore, they're costing society billions of dollars because they took a day off and no, to go, whatever it is that they're going to do, right? It's like watching Netflix, go to the doctor be sick, whatever it is. So they're saying, so looking at this, there's an appendix that sing a owl in in in that piece is talking about the costs of fatness and how it's broken down. And so they look at health, societal and workplace. And it's saying one of the things here, severe Oh, attributed to the increased absenteeism, which cost 5.3 8 billion, and then how much increased absenteeism does severe in quotation marks. Oh, like how many more days are fat people taking? Allegedly? Because of their fatness? A whopping one day. Ha God so a super fat person has more has allegedly takes one day more off in a year than someone who is smaller than super fat. Huh, huh. Could could a super fat person be experiencing? Hmm. Are they taking a day off a whole day? Oh, my God, and they're taking a day off? Because of their fatness? Could they also be experiencing oh shit ton of bias and workplace that's probably not accommodating them in any way. They denied access to health care? Yes. Especially when we're talking about people who are the largest fat people in our society, the amount of shit that they have to go through. Like the list is endless. And could that increased shit they have to go through in every different aspect of their life because of anti fat bias leads to maybe one day extra a year. Huh, I think that could That sounds about right. But let's just No, let's just not let's not consider that. We'll just say they've costing the economy 5.3 8 billion because they're so fun awful, obviously. I mean, Billy's la Leigh and as well if someone dies in their fat been died from fatness it's a comorbidity right someone gets hit by hit by a car. Wow. They died while fat so they died from fatness obviously. Oh, it's just so. So I posted I posted about this on on a very old Instagram. And there's a couple of comments that I wanted to point out is Tigris, who was on the show a few episodes ago said on top of everything you've said here. And even more errors in even more irresponsible reporting. Sometimes the cost of Oh word is the cost of everyone who has a condition associated with being fat, including the cost of treating all the thing people who have that condition. The cost of treating everyone on Earth who has diabetes is not a cost of Oh word. Millions of them people have that. Isn't it just bananas like tigers totally spot on here. So if a thin person has type two diabetes, well, they are they're contributing towards the cost of fatness and society allegedly, they're not fat but hairy M the fat that fat and bought empowerment chick said I read a study recently that talked about the burden of words and the quote, social impact and it gave a figure of 11,463 Euros per person per year. So I read it a little further. These costs included the price of mandatory health insurance, speech therapists, acupuncturists, household expenditures, aka groceries and dining out clothes, transportation costs, transportation costs, attempts at weight loss and social activities. Their conclusion Oh words have a considerable impact The societal costs, sorry, what do straight sides people not pay for food, drink, transport, clothes and socializing? So yeah, these so called research findings will tell you anything you want to hear. So so the other costs in here that that they that is claimed that the cost of fatness is things like giving fat people access. So giving fat people a gown that fits at the hospital, or having a wheelchair that is bigger. So you know, spending on a medical spending. So it's literally the existence of fatness that they're saying costs, but they're not doing the same for the cost of, quote, thinness a core cost, there is no cost to end you know these things. But they're not saying okay, well of our medical equipment. 95% of Ms. Probably less than that, just for like more than that. It's very, like 99% of the medical equipment costs that we we spend our on straight size people on equipment that only hold straight size, people are on blood pressure cuffs that accommodate straight size people 1% 2% Whatever it is, I'm just plucking these numbers out of out of thin air. We spend on equipment that accommodates bigger bodies, which is by the way that a lot of people have bigger bodies, which is so bizarre that we'd have so little equipment for people in bigger bodies. So all of that other cost for medical equipment. That's not a burden. But when it comes to accommodating someone who has a larger body, then all of a sudden that's a cost and a burden. The cost of if Imagine if we if we calculate the cost of fineness. It's so ridiculous. I'd even say you know the cost of thinness and they say oranges and we say cost of fatness Imagine if we calculate the cost of fitness the cost of tenders would be like a medical equipment is almost exclusively only made for thin people, right? So we'd be gone Can't you win in comparison to the cost of equipment for people in bigger bodies? Right. So anyway, health as well diseases and slash complication. Okay, so, you know, that's all diseases that are associated with it. fatness that same people get as well. So that's flawed. Increased life and medical insurance. Okay, so increase life and medical insurance. That is based on the BMI which is total bullshit. And based on weight bias because they're charging fat people more because of the presumption that fat people die sooner and have more fat related conditions, premature mortality and reduced quality of life. Again, we have seen the data to show that actually, people who are smaller fat live longer than people who are quote normal weight and people who are very fat there is not really that much of a difference between them and quote, normal weight people reduced quality of life or reduced quality of life. Well, could that be from anti fat bias years? Next, I look at workplace private monetary losses due to reduced output, job performance and labor income slash profit. So they're blaming fat people now because a company full of company profits, what? They're blaming fat people for monetary losses due to reduced output. Where is the data that fat people have reduced output? Where does this come from? And with CertainTeed absent absentee to absentee ism, including paid sick leaves Oh, look at you know, fat people using the benefits that they are legally entitled to look at that. That's terrible. Just just blinking in disbelief at this. So the societal that they say is increased economic burden slash reduced tax income. Fat people are paid less because of because of this is the way that society views fat people because of shit like this. And so fat people are paid less. So therefore fat people are a burden because they're paid less because of anti fat bias.

What I increased tax revenue use for health care. Just where is where's the data? We were what? Higher treatment physician and equipment costs. Are we saying that the Do we have the same data for people in smaller baggy bodies? Fat people are causing longer wait times in primary care in hospitals? If that were true? Could it be could it be? Could it be Could it be because of the absolute dogshit healthcare that many fat people experience means that they're less likely to go to a health care provider because they know they're just going to be told to lose weight? Could it be then when they become very, very sick, then they will need to access a higher level of care? Because they've been ignored? Or even if they do go, then we're just dismissed? You know, just go to some weight. So what So what is the cause? Is it the fat person existing or is it subpar healthcare and anti fabulous? I your your, your your boy. It just you know that so often we take a lot of this stuff for granted. You know, like of course, you know, fat people cost society more money. And you think, Well, of course people are going to use common sense, you know, researchers and people collecting this data are going to use common sense. And of course, they're going to be able to, they look at say, okay, a fat person and say, Okay, let's look at the diseases or conditions or whatever it is. It's definitely caused by fatness. Oh, well, we don't have any evidence. Well, that's okay. We'll just do associated with Okay, so let's just do associated with those two conditions associated with fatness. Okay, so every fat person that has any type of condition that's caused by fatness, right, okay, yeah, yeah. And you know, at that point, is it that point someone should step in and be like, This doesn't sound right. Maybe less, not? Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe we should use more nuance with collecting this data and actually use I don't know, evidence and reliable practices and, and should we be even cost like, do it in a cost of the quote, burden of fat people? Isn't that just an identity? Like fatness? Like if we're doing a call stuff fatness thing. Should we not be doing also a cost of blondeness on society, the cost of tallness on society the cost of having blue eyes on society. Everyone that has blue eyes, if they have, I don't know, a sore toe, then ah, that's the cost of blue eyes for Yeah, those greedy blue eyed people with their sore toes. And the reason why and the reason why the there isn't an I'm sure there are people in the, you know, collecting the data that's like, this is kinda fishy. sound right? This is kind of misleading. There's definitely people in there who were who were who were raising the red flags. Because anti fat bias is so well ingrained in the DNA of our society. It takes a very brave person, especially in that field, imagine you've got a job, and you're getting paid to calculate these costs. Would you really stand up and be like, hey, fat people? You know, they maybe we don't have that data to show. That fatness causes these things and the correlation causation. And is this really ethical to be doing that? No, you probably just keep your head down, collect the paycheck, and align with the common narrative that we have out there. Because, quote, we all know that fatness is this terrible thing. It must be very difficult to have differing opinions or to to steer the ship, because this is huge ship of, of health care and the ship of anti fat bias and say, Oh, maybe all everything that we've been talking about for all of these decades is not really that helpful. It's that's a that's a that's a big thing, right? And then when you have people who are like, Yeah, we fucking love this, we love this data like government saying, like, we need to, we need this data, because we need to understand the burdens that these types of people have on our society. So that we can try and mitigate these costs by trying to get fat people to become thinner people. It makes sense why people want this information in this data, but it's just so misguided. There's so many faulty, faulty faulty premises to so much of this. I wonder if they're gonna if people are going to stop making these reports? Probably Probably not. Because I would suspect that a lot of there's a lot of there is a lot of lobbying from pharmaceutical health care, weight loss companies to to get this type of data, because it shows what a terrible problem quote, fatness is, so therefore, our drugs, our pills, our diets are so needed, because what a better way to show that fat people need not exist is by saying that they cost the world billions of dollars from for for a non modifiable identity factor, which many people believe is modifiable, but it's just we don't have that we just don't have that information to say that it is that we can in any type of meaningful amounts or for any type of you know, length of someone's life. All of this just as Scott milma fucking annoyed me. Something just to talk about is the some people like it on my Instagram have said, well, then they're not this is this is bad because they're not calculating the costs of alcohol use for Yeah, like other things that people perceive as choice based illnesses. Well, I just I don't really agree with with that, because I'll tell you why. Someone who is using alcohol, we know that you know, someone someone using alcohol or someone using drugs or whatever it is, that a lot of the times those people are in an addiction. And we know that that is not a choice, right? I don't want to say you know, even if something that I don't agree with, say I'd know. Someone uses a gun and she shoots her For whatever, I still wouldn't want to be like, Oh, listen, people who shoot their foot are such a cost on society, on our tax dollars, because I think that we shouldn't be talking about humans that way. The other side of that is the cost of allowing guns in society on like, literally guns killing people. Like I think that's, that's really important, obviously. But I think people's personal choices is, I don't, I don't care if someone is using health care, because they're doing something that I have said that I think is bad, because it's got nothing to do with me, right. Because there's some people have that thought of, well, if my tax cut my tax dollars are going to support someone who is outside of, of doing something that I don't like them, that's bad. That's not how I feel, you know, like, I pay taxes and many different types of benefits, I will not get, for example, benefits for you know, I won't have children using the school systems because I don't want kids but I'm really pleased that the kids in our society can go to school, and if people get the access to university or, or kids get reduced dental costs or whatever, or in Canada, there's going to be there's like some dental thing that's coming out next year, people who have a lower income and elderly and children get some parts of some free dental, I'm probably not going to benefit from that. At the beginning. I don't care. I'm pleased that the the elders and young people and very low income people, I would prefer if everyone would get it, you know, just because I want everyone to be happy, and you know, all that type of stuff. So, you know, I feel like the that other way of viewing of like,

I need to get my share and everything needs to be equal, comes from a very conservative and unkind way of looking at humanity. I want everyone to be happy and to be able to access health care and to be feel like they are welcome in society, and not like they are a burden. And I wonder if in the UK, I know I've definitely felt this. So I'm in Canada, in case you didn't know, I'm in Canada, but I'm British Irish. I spent the first couple of decades in my God in the UK. I hope soon it will be like in five years, I would have been spent more time in Canada than in the UK. Oh my that's scary. Anyway, in my experience of being in the UK and accessing the NHS national health services that my belief was my my perception was, do not use the NHS unless you're fucking dying. Unless you are really fucking sick. Don't go to the doctor, don't spend any time talking to the doctor. Unless you know you need to be in there. Quack, quack, quack, just hurry the fuck up, get in, get out and you better be sick. If not, you're a burden on the NHS, those messages. Just constant. That's what that's how I feel. If you're British, you might be like, Yeah, I felt like too. And I felt like you know, that's a very kind of post World War Two, the stiff upper lip, all band together, which you know, all banded together great. But also people deserve health care. And it wasn't until I came to Canada so when I left the UK, I took an inhaler. Pretty much that was all I ever took Nayla came to Canada I got diagnosed with so many things because I felt a little bit more comfortable even though we do have healthcare here. And this is kind of similar situation as a UK. I hadn't been indoctrinated with those messages, have you better fucking be dead before coming in here. And I felt like I could say, Oh, what about this? Now I take loads of different medications because there was things that I was ignoring in the UK that I didn't feel safe enough to go to the doctor and say, Hey, I feel cold and tired all the time. You know, and they're like, oh, it's because you your thyroid is just being is destroyed. Oh, you know, because you think yeah, we're gonna go to the doctor because you're cold and tired. But in Canada, I felt like I could you know and all the other things so anyway anyway was I feel good about that. Yeah, is that I don't want people to feel like that. And I'm sure I'm you know, and I'm sure there are people who are over I don't know if you want to use it overuse. Don't really like the thought of that. If people need help, like and I can just imagine, you know, some some right wing person being like, oh, there's people will go in and go to the doctor every day. And all I've got is a sniffle. And yeah, you know, I'm sure there are people who maybe go to the doctor when they, then they're fine, but obviously something else is going on, right? They obviously need need something from that interaction. So I, I don't know, I just, I just want to be nice, just be nice to everyone I, I, that's the one that I want. So I'm just gonna, you know, put that out there because I'm just feeling very annoyed with all of this stuff that we're talking about humans in this way and, and know that in my world, I'm creating a nice community around me and I do have a nice community around me where we're all kind to each other and, and, you know, my neighbors are all nice, and all my friends are all, we don't talk about each other like that. And so there you go, that's my constellation. I hope you have that. I hope you have that too. You have people around you that make you feel like you're not a burden, and you're not a terrible person for being fat. And if you don't have that, then fat communities out there. And you might say, well, there's no fat community where I live and that's okay, you can access fat community on the internet web.com. So you can just go on the internet and find people, even if it's just following other fat people and joining Facebook groups that have fat people, or watching shows with fat people or reading books with fat people. Ah, segue perfect segue, you might say Feeny, I don't know where to find those things. Guess where you can find those things. And that is in the size diversity Resource Guide, which you can get for $5 If you go and join my kofi. The link will be somewhere around here. Wherever you're listening. Kofi KO fyi.com forward slash first fatter you'll find it for so for $5 Join the fight baby fat here you'll get the size diversity resource guide. And that's going to help me keep making the podcast for you. And bring you fatty goodness every month. All right. So if you want to do that great if not, then you know that's fine. So that's all good. That's all good. No, no pressure. No pressure. You don't you okay, you do you and for the people who are supporting me on cofee. Oh my goodness. You are the best. I really appreciate it. It's I find it so strange that people I had no support my work I didn't want to why I find it strange. But it's just so awesome. It's just so cool. Like, yeah, so thank you. Thank you. I really appreciate you if you are a member on my cofee shout out to you. You're the best. You're the dog's bollocks. You're the What's another word for that? Now I can't think of it as long as I there's another rhyming thing. And that dog's bollocks is not rhyming though is it? So anyway, I'll stop babbling on. Thanks for hanging out with me today. Sending you big fatty hugs. And I will see you in the next episode. Remember to stay fierce fatty, you are worthy you always were you always will be. Sona.